Canned vs frozen vs fresh vs dried

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Canned vs frozen vs fresh vs dried
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tahir

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 45661
Location: Essex

Posted: Wed Feb 26, 20 5:56 pm Post subject: Canned vs frozen vs fresh vs dried

Something I've wondered for years. Let's say we take peas, how do we assess relative CO2 impacts of:

Fresh:
UK in season
Imported, refrigerated truck
Imported, seafreight
Imported, airfreight

Frozen:
UK
Imported

Canned:
UK
Imported

Dried:
UK
Imported

So many permutations, also I guess depends on how long you store. On frozen there's a cost in maintaining the product in it's frozen state within the distribution chain and in the home.

Nicky cigreen

Joined: 25 Jun 2007
Posts: 9858
Location: Devon, uk

Posted: Wed Feb 26, 20 6:07 pm Post subject:
doing the right thing is so complicated sometimes...

tahir

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 45661
Location: Essex

Posted: Wed Feb 26, 20 6:29 pm Post subject:
It truly is

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28229
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Wed Feb 26, 20 7:44 pm Post subject:
I'm especially curious on the dried goods front. I'd guess they would be one of the best rated. It is also notable just how little by way of dried stuff is in supermarkets, certainly ASDA is awful.

Ty Gwyn

Joined: 22 Sep 2010
Posts: 4610
Location: Lampeter

Posted: Wed Feb 26, 20 8:15 pm Post subject:
Leo pea`s in a cardboard box,soak in a net.

Nicky cigreen

Joined: 25 Jun 2007
Posts: 9858
Location: Devon, uk

Posted: Wed Feb 26, 20 9:09 pm Post subject:
I don't even know how the dry peas.. with heat? just naturally?

Slim

Joined: 05 Mar 2006
Posts: 6610
Location: New England (In the US of A)

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 20 12:23 am Post subject:

Frozen is likely best for vitamins, etc. I wonder about energy for frozen maintenance, probably corresponds with amount of times its shifted and the freezer needs to work to cool down a warm air mass again.

Afaik, dry peas, a la split peas for soup are almost entirely air dried, but fancier freeze dried sweet peas likely take a fair amount of energy.

Canned veggies have the initial cooking and heat treating for packaging, and then the added weight of the packaging to be shipped around as well.

Frozen and canned probably both have a lot less food waste than fresh

Slim

Joined: 05 Mar 2006
Posts: 6610
Location: New England (In the US of A)

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 20 12:32 am Post subject:

Doesn't touch on frozen or canned: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/248707578_A_Life_Cycle_Analysis_of_Packaging_Systems_for_Fruit_and_Vegetable_Transport_in_Europe

Also: https://www.surrey.ac.uk/ces/files/pdf/0108_CES_WP_RELU_Integ_LCA_local_vs_global_vegs.pdf

This one may answer more of your question:
https://css.umich.edu/sites/default/files/css_doc/CSS17-04.pdf

There's a bunch of people that have already asked this question, lots more studies out there on the Google!

Mistress Rose

Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 15936

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 20 8:11 am Post subject:

I suppose it is healthy that we are asking that question. I haven't had time to read all the stuff you posted Slim, but thanks for putting it up.

As far as split dried peas are concerned, they are not really the same beast as fresh or frozen peas, as I think they are left to dry naturally in the field, then finished off. Not sure about their vitamin content, but they are a good source of protein and carbohydrate. I recently made some rather nice pea and ham soup from them using them as the base and adding a tin of processed peas to my husbands and frozen peas to mine (our tastes differ on the subject of peas).

gz

Joined: 23 Jan 2009
Posts: 8882
Location: Ayrshire, Scotland

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 20 10:03 am Post subject:
I think that you have to add in the costs of frozen storage, and the risks to frozen of power cuts...

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46169
Location: yes

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 20 11:28 am Post subject:

not enough data for meaningful answer

instinct says local grown and delivered by hand is best, dried is often a neat way of doing stuff. they are first and probably second in a low impact competition. perhaps tinned is good for co2 free storage but it needs a tin(high co2) and does mean hauling water as well as peas, frozen needs freezing and keeping cold which could be co2 free but usually is not.

frozen is nice and i am not sure i want to know if it is too co2stly if i want a few peas at short notice.
proper dried is essential for mushy
chooks thrive on micronised flaked peas as part of a balanced diet , chook peas make a pretty good mushy peas as well

i would grow more of em if i had space as fresh from the vine are ace, frozen are nearly as good.

the co2 aspect does matter if you look at a big picture but so does the impact of monoculture using pesticides, weed suppressors and desiccant at harvest.

sun dried from home grown organic vines is probably almost co2 zero.

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 46169
Location: yes

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 20 11:30 am Post subject:
ps will read slim's posts and see if i change my opinion.

tahir

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 45661
Location: Essex

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 20 11:32 am Post subject:
Thanks slim quite heavy reading there!

Nicky cigreen

Joined: 25 Jun 2007
Posts: 9858
Location: Devon, uk

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 20 12:28 pm Post subject:
I've always assumed - based on nothing at all - that it was better say, to use frozen peppers than use peppers flown in from rainforest cleared countries... better still to only eat peppers when they are in season locally obviously. but it is an interesting question.. sometimes things are the reverse of what you expect.

tahir

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 45661
Location: Essex

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 20 1:00 pm Post subject:
Iâ€™ve been trying to work it out for decades with no progress

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